I'm currently torn between a few different leveling mods.- +5 All Attribute Modifiers- Galerion Natural Leveling Revised- Realistic LevelingI like them all for different reasons. With +5 Al Attribute Modifiers, it's a simple mod that is as close to the Vanilla game as possible, except without all the micromanaging of efficient leveling. However, I fear that my character may become too overpowered from getting such high bonuses each level.Galerion would be my second choice, and seems to be the favorite of a lot of people, but I'm curious as to how over or under powered a late game character would look like with this system in place. Also, I can't seem to get the console commands for customizing it to work, but that's not a deal breaker because it seems pretty well balanced the way it is.Realistic Leveling also seems to be used by a ton of people who swear by it and I'm curious as to why anyone would pick that over Galerion or just having +5 to all attributes. It seems a bit too complicated for my liking but I could be persuaded either way.I'd just like to hear the thoughts of people who have used these mods long term and what the outcome will look like on a play through late game. Thanks, cheers! Instead of using a character leveling you could just use a world leveling overhaul.

That would solve the problem too. Most of the world leveling overhails don't require altering the character leveling, since they 'fix' the vanilla problems in their own ways.As for the character leveling mods you've listed, the +5 attr one is the simplest and risk free way, but it works best if you avoid leveling up too much.

Vinicia Melissaeia, an Imperial noble, is the person responsible for taking all complaints about Imperial City merchants. She also sells the house in the Imperial City for 2,000 gold. She can be found in the Office of Imperial Commerce located in the Market District. Vinicia wears a set of upper-class clothing, consisting of a red velvet blouse, a red velvet garment, a piece of jewelry, and a. Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion - Trade and Commerce Mod. This mod allows you to run your own store, you can put on sale any item you have collected in your adventures. Hire a shopkeeper to take care of your business while you are away and a guard to protect your valuables. Pay weekly wages to your employees and weekly taxes based on your weekly income.

Up to L15 at most or so. Past that you'd become a bit overpowered IMO, unless you consciously restrain/sabotage yourself on some level ups (like, f.e., adding points to a stat that is of no use to your combat skills every so and so levels.)EDIT: Ofc. You could instead use the +3 version (instead of the +5 one) and that would average up to a normal leveled up character, even if it would be a tad slightly less efficient at the start.I've used RL myself in the past, and I liked it. But I remember having some problems at some point, but sadly I don't remember the specifics.

What I remember is it just stopped working and had to clean reinstall it.These days, I've settled on the combination of Oscuro's and/or Maskar's (world leveling) + nGCD (character leveling.)Keep in mind that if you don't use a world overhaul even if you'll not be eventually underpowered as in vanilla Oblivion, you'll still have to deal with common bandits in daedric gear by L18 or so. I've never used any of those mods and it would take the challenge and fun out of the game if I didn't have to get the +5 the hard way. I have to put in the hard slog and time it takes to earn +5 to be able to enjoy the game later on when I can look back on the effort I've put in to get there.

It's especially important because when I play Oblivion the campaign can last for years as I'm always adding quest mods to keep me busy. Once I've completed the main quest I lose interest so instead I do other things while the main quest is in progress. My last game started in 2011 and only ended when my PC died in January this year. I still had Light The Dragonfires in progress so Martin was still hanging out at Cloud Ruler Temple.There are a lot of ways you can make life easier when getting the +5 +5 +5 before every level up. The lid of a Bic pen is invaluable as the shape of it fits perfectly between the keys of my keyboard so I can use it to jam the cast key and make it easier to skill up the magic disciplines.

You can also do this with the block key. Using summons to fight against can increase other skills and I always visit a trainer at the start of every level. I've realised now that I should visit the trainer last because that will make life easier getting the initial five skill increases. Getting them after I have visited a trainer will result in more time because a skill increase takes longer the more skilled you are but I always do it first because otherwise I will forget to do it. I need to make some Oblivion checklists on paper.There is a UESP page about Skill Books and this is handy for finding them all. There are 5/6 for every skill so they can come in useful to speed up the skill increases.

Some involve tresspassing and theft but if you're sneaky you can avoid a bounty.You can increase sneak just by sneaking next to someone sleeping. Armorour is an important skill to get to journeyman as early as possible because then you can repair your own magical gear. I train this up quickly by going through Sundercliff Watch at least once every level. It's a vast dungeon with about 50 humanoid enemies and several boss chests so by the end of it you have a lot of gear to repair.

This needs extra storage like the Bag Of Holding or Midas Chest but it means you can get your armour skill up to 50 within a few levels and you're then much more self sufficient and prepared for longer quests.You can get creative working out how to increase multiple skills at once. I summoned a permanent skeleton and attacked it so it turned hostile and this increases light armour/heavy armour (if you're wearing both kinds then both skills will increase. Slower than just wearing one kind of armour but the both increase)Jam the block key against a hostile summon to make training it easier. Use a weak summon like the skeleton so you take the least damage and eventually their attack will have no effect so you could block indefinitely. I train like this but I don't go overboard and leave it while I go shopping.

I just get a few skill increases at a time and use it to train blade and destruction.The only skill I find tedious to increase is mercantile so I dump everything at my shop in Chorral which is added by the Trade And Commerce mod and just use trainers to increase it. Originally posted by:I've never used any of those mods and it would take the challenge and fun out of the game if I didn't have to get the +5 the hard way.

I have to put in the hard slog and time it takes to earn +5 to be able to enjoy the game later on when I can look back on the effort I've put in to get there. It's especially important because when I play Oblivion the campaign can last for years as I'm always adding quest mods to keep me busy. Once I've completed the main quest I lose interest so instead I do other things while the main quest is in progress.

My last game started in 2011 and only ended when my PC died in January this year. I still had Light The Dragonfires in progress so Martin was still hanging out at Cloud Ruler Temple.There are a lot of ways you can make life easier when getting the +5 +5 +5 before every level up.

The lid of a Bic pen is invaluable as the shape of it fits perfectly between the keys of my keyboard so I can use it to jam the cast key and make it easier to skill up the magic disciplines. You can also do this with the block key. Using summons to fight against can increase other skills and I always visit a trainer at the start of every level.

I've realised now that I should visit the trainer last because that will make life easier getting the initial five skill increases. Getting them after I have visited a trainer will result in more time because a skill increase takes longer the more skilled you are but I always do it first because otherwise I will forget to do it. I need to make some Oblivion checklists on paper.There is a UESP page about Skill Books and this is handy for finding them all. There are 5/6 for every skill so they can come in useful to speed up the skill increases. Some involve tresspassing and theft but if you're sneaky you can avoid a bounty.You can increase sneak just by sneaking next to someone sleeping. Armorour is an important skill to get to journeyman as early as possible because then you can repair your own magical gear.

I train this up quickly by going through Sundercliff Watch at least once every level. It's a vast dungeon with about 50 humanoid enemies and several boss chests so by the end of it you have a lot of gear to repair. This needs extra storage like the Bag Of Holding or Midas Chest but it means you can get your armour skill up to 50 within a few levels and you're then much more self sufficient and prepared for longer quests.You can get creative working out how to increase multiple skills at once. I summoned a permanent skeleton and attacked it so it turned hostile and this increases light armour/heavy armour (if you're wearing both kinds then both skills will increase. Slower than just wearing one kind of armour but the both increase)Jam the block key against a hostile summon to make training it easier.

Use a weak summon like the skeleton so you take the least damage and eventually their attack will have no effect so you could block indefinitely. I train like this but I don't go overboard and leave it while I go shopping. I just get a few skill increases at a time and use it to train blade and destruction.The only skill I find tedious to increase is mercantile so I dump everything at my shop in Chorral which is added by the Trade And Commerce mod and just use trainers to increase it.You mean that you dont wanna work and progress your character in system that more you train one thing the stronger in the thing you become? Why are you playin the game then?

This lvl system is awesome. Like to get +5 in agi you need to train 10 times in agility made disciplines which makes sneakin and so on. That is why most of the time the disciplines you get your main should be the major but minor skills due to fact that then you can train more in these disciplines.

The concept is realistic and makes sense. It s like in real world. You practice somethin you get better in it. Nothin wrong with that. Originally posted by:I've never used any of those mods and it would take the challenge and fun out of the game if I didn't have to get the +5 the hard way.

I have to put in the hard slog and time it takes to earn +5 to be able to enjoy the game later on when I can look back on the effort I've put in to get there. It's especially important because when I play Oblivion the campaign can last for years as I'm always adding quest mods to keep me busy. Once I've completed the main quest I lose interest so instead I do other things while the main quest is in progress. My last game started in 2011 and only ended when my PC died in January this year. I still had Light The Dragonfires in progress so Martin was still hanging out at Cloud Ruler Temple.There are a lot of ways you can make life easier when getting the +5 +5 +5 before every level up. The lid of a Bic pen is invaluable as the shape of it fits perfectly between the keys of my keyboard so I can use it to jam the cast key and make it easier to skill up the magic disciplines. You can also do this with the block key.

Using summons to fight against can increase other skills and I always visit a trainer at the start of every level. I've realised now that I should visit the trainer last because that will make life easier getting the initial five skill increases. Getting them after I have visited a trainer will result in more time because a skill increase takes longer the more skilled you are but I always do it first because otherwise I will forget to do it. I need to make some Oblivion checklists on paper.There is a UESP page about Skill Books and this is handy for finding them all. There are 5/6 for every skill so they can come in useful to speed up the skill increases. Some involve tresspassing and theft but if you're sneaky you can avoid a bounty.You can increase sneak just by sneaking next to someone sleeping.

Armorour is an important skill to get to journeyman as early as possible because then you can repair your own magical gear. I train this up quickly by going through Sundercliff Watch at least once every level. It's a vast dungeon with about 50 humanoid enemies and several boss chests so by the end of it you have a lot of gear to repair. This needs extra storage like the Bag Of Holding or Midas Chest but it means you can get your armour skill up to 50 within a few levels and you're then much more self sufficient and prepared for longer quests.You can get creative working out how to increase multiple skills at once.

I summoned a permanent skeleton and attacked it so it turned hostile and this increases light armour/heavy armour (if you're wearing both kinds then both skills will increase. Slower than just wearing one kind of armour but the both increase)Jam the block key against a hostile summon to make training it easier. Use a weak summon like the skeleton so you take the least damage and eventually their attack will have no effect so you could block indefinitely. I train like this but I don't go overboard and leave it while I go shopping.

I just get a few skill increases at a time and use it to train blade and destruction.The only skill I find tedious to increase is mercantile so I dump everything at my shop in Chorral which is added by the Trade And Commerce mod and just use trainers to increase it.You mean that you dont wanna work and progress your character in system that more you train one thing the stronger in the thing you become? Why are you playin the game then? This lvl system is awesome. Like to get +5 in agi you need to train 10 times in agility made disciplines which makes sneakin and so on. That is why most of the time the disciplines you get your main should be the major but minor skills due to fact that then you can train more in these disciplines. The concept is realistic and makes sense.

It s like in real world. You practice somethin you get better in it. Nothin wrong with that.except focusing on only 1 aspect is boring as ♥♥♥♥. Originally posted by:You mean that you dont wanna work and progress your character in system that more you train one thing the stronger in the thing you become? Why are you playin the game then? This lvl system is awesome.

Like to get +5 in agi you need to train 10 times in agility made disciplines which makes sneakin and so on. That is why most of the time the disciplines you get your main should be the major but minor skills due to fact that then you can train more in these disciplines. The concept is realistic and makes sense. It s like in real world. You practice somethin you get better in it.

Nothin wrong with that.I'm not sure why you have quoted my post because what you are saying is exactly the point I was making. The levelling system works and doesn't need to be modded. It just takes some people, myself included a while to get their head around it.

Using mods to speed up the skill increases or attribute increases takes fun out of the early game. It's no different to using the duplicate glitch to get rich quick.Having said that I also think once you have played a game at least once the way it's meant to be played you are then free to re-play it any way you like. Originally posted by:You mean that you dont wanna work and progress your character in system that more you train one thing the stronger in the thing you become? Why are you playin the game then? This lvl system is awesome. Like to get +5 in agi you need to train 10 times in agility made disciplines which makes sneakin and so on. That is why most of the time the disciplines you get your main should be the major but minor skills due to fact that then you can train more in these disciplines.

The concept is realistic and makes sense. It s like in real world. You practice somethin you get better in it. Nothin wrong with that.except focusing on only 1 aspect is boring as ♥♥♥♥.Aha okay. Dude why are you even play the game? That blows my mind so hard. The lvlin system is top notch.

It s hard, you need use your brain, and it s very revarding. I just do balanced character creation now. Involved you starting off somewhat weak but you get stronger throughout the game. I picked a Breton, am playing as a fighter and just take the strong combat focused bonuses. Originally posted by:except focusing on only 1 aspect is boring as ♥♥♥♥.Aha okay. Dude why are you even play the game? That blows my mind so hard.

The lvlin system is top notch. Potty racers 5 hacked. It s hard, you need use your brain, and it s very revarding.

I get what you're saying but there's still another way of looking at this, that isn't brought up as much as perhaps it 'should' be for this kind of game - an RPG.It's a roleplaying game which means that the point is to play a character, who could broadly speaking be said to fit into a certain class and not to master everything.

Contents.Table of available gold for various merchants? Would it be possible to add a table showing the available gold for each merchant in Cyrodil?

Or at least the ones who offer the pre-Expert max of 1200 gold? — Unsigned comment by (. ) There already is such a table; the. 00:31, 13 July 2007 (EDT)Thanks!

Perhaps a link here, then? — Unsigned comment by (. ) You're free to modify the page as you think necessary. But I'm not sure what more you think needs to be done: the first sentence of already explicitly says 'these values are also listed on the page and on the individual merchants' pages'. 12:17, 13 July 2007 (EDT) Investments Can you Invest in a merchant more then once? — Unsigned comment by (.

) No. –. 00:43, 31 March 2008 (EDT) Rpeh is correct, multiple investment could imbalance the game drastically, as you could sell rare items at a far too high price, especially when duplication is added into the mix of things, and so it could happen that you collect so much gold from this that the game crashes because of memory overload. Bad things could happen is what I'm saying 12:11, 1 January 2009 (EST) Merge with Oblivion:Mercantile I suggest merging this page with. There seems no reason why there should be three pages, and discussing the same subject: the sale of items in Oblivion. I can understand why there are two separate pages, because the table is so long, but I see no reason why this page can't be merged with.Support and proposed.

19:26, 10 September 2008 (EDT)Oppose: I'm not sure this is the best plan. Oblivion:Merchants is already a page with which we have and making it larger isn't going to help.

Instead, I'd keep only the standard sections on the Mercantile page (Character Creation, Skill Increases and Tips) and move the rest on to Commerce. You're right that the pages duplicate too much at the moment, but I think we still need the three pages. –. 01:38, 11 September 2008 (EDT)Oppose I agree with; the Mercantile page needs to be cleared of most of what is in there and leave only the standard stuff. The rest of it can be cleaned up and put into the Commerce article. 06:26, 11 September 2008 (EDT) Added Bartering to Commerce as proposed by Rpeh.

(-) 01:13, 29 May 2009 (EDT) Bartering The article states the variables to the Barter system, but how exactly are these values used? Is there an equation of some sort that affects the level at which you can Barter with a merchant? - 20:01, 28 June 2010 (UTC) I agree in that someone should work out some calculations with the slider with respect to varying Mercantile differences and dispositions. Or they could at least have a rule of thumb ( x disposition at y Skill = z position on the bar). We console users really can't arbitrate such data, I wouldn't think.

Not without PC support. 19:32, 24 October 2010 (UTC) Barter doesn't mean negotiating about price I've noticed that unfortunately the word 'barter' has been used when talking about haggling over prices.

Barter is the exchange of goods and services for those of equal value, it doesn't mean bargaining over a monetary transaction. I kinda wish Oblivion.did. have a barter system, it would mean we'd have a chance of swapping a couple of pieces of high value armour for one that was even better!Not sure why this confusion about barter has occurred, the button in the trade screen is called the Haggle button, after all. — Unsigned comment by at 11:54 on 1 July 2010 Blame that on the game manual itself. They incorrectly use the term 'bartering' to mean 'buying and selling', not 'exchanging goods and services'. I suspect it was confused with 'bargaining' or something along those lines.

Feel free to change them, though you may want to note somewhere on the page that the manual refers to the process as 'bartering'. ‒ ↝ 19:26, 2 July 2010 (UTC) Verification This is the first time I've edited a wiki, so I'm not entirely sure how to 'verify' the small bug of changing the haggle slider, pressing cancel and the changes still happening next time you talk to them. I've tried it with a few merchants and it seems to be true, so do I just remove the small 'verification needed' bit on the page?

Yup, and leave an edit summary saying that you did verify the bug. Thanks!- 13:50, 17 July 2010 (UTC) Hawkhaven glitch? The article states that Hawkhaven can be entered by exploiting a glitch. I am assuming this is to be done on the console version of the game? I don't see much point in exploiting a glitch on the PC when you have free access to everywhere at your fingertips.

The link just brings me to the Frostcrag glitch page and makes no mention of accessing Hawkhaven. Little help, please? 19:27, 24 October 2010 (UTC) I'm not sure, but it seems that the test world that the Frostcrag Spire glitch takes you is the same world that Hawkhaven is located, so by exploring the world you will find Hawkhaven. I think this is wrong though, as the only thing I managed to in Hawkhaven's world is the Creature Testing Hall, which can also be accesed by the Testing Hall. Haggling Does anyone know the full haggle formula? Looking it up on the CS wiki gives me a lot of game settings, but no detail on how they interact. 09:10, 20 March 2011 (UTC)I captured 100 points of data and performed a 3d surface fit to the data to come up with an approximate haggle formula by using the difference between player and merchant mercantile skill as the X axis, the merchant's disposition as the Y axis, and the resultant improvement over the minimum haggle as the Z axis.

The function's terms and coefficients bear little resemblance to the fBarter game settings given in the construction set. The resultant formula was Z=(17.3754 +.1741.X +.09.Y). So, if your mercantile skill is 51, the merchant's is 60, and the merchant's disposition towards you is 36: 51-60 = -9 = X, 36 = Y, and you could move the slider 19 points above the minimum haggle.

It's interesting to note that, even if you only have 5 mercantile skill to a master merchant's 100, and even if they hated your guts (0 disposition), if you can initiate trade, you should be able to haggle for 1% more than their worst prices. 03:40, 22 March 2011 (UTC) Your formula seems correct to me, but you forgot that luck influences skill effectiveness (see next discussion, below) so it was most likely luck that made it look wrong. Also, would it be possible that someone would make a Mercantile Calculator where you input your mercantile skill, the merchants skill, their disposition to you and your luck? I mean, there is an Alchemy Calculator already, so why not make a Mercantile Calculator as well? 20:28, 9 January 2012 (UTC) Luck I believe that Luck may have an affect on your bartering skills.

I'm going to do a bit of experimenting, but I got a bit higher prices from The Dividing Line while under the affect of the Luck boost from the Lucky Old Lady. I went back the next day and got a bunch of offer refused messages until I toned the deal down a little. 22:56, 27 October 2011 (UTC) It does, at least on the Xbox version. I'm using The Dividing Line as a test.

Just as myself, I can sell at 69% currently with a Mercantile rank of 52 and Disposition at 100. With a 50 point luck boost taking me to 100 Luck, I can sell at 73%. 23:29, 27 October 2011 (UTC)Of course it does. Luck increases the effective value of all your skills, meaning that it increases your mercantile and speechcraft skills, both of which improve prices. 23:47, 27 October 2011 (UTC)Then the particular effect should be mentioned here, shouldn't they? - 16:53, 28 October 2011 (UTC)Almost certainly not, because if you try boosting Luck when your Mercantile and Speechcraft skills are maxed out at 100, you should see absolutely no improvement.

I haven't actually done this, mind you, but enough people have attested to how Luck works that I'm comfortable believing them. If you'd like to test yourself by maxing out Speechcraft, Mercantile, and the vendor's Disposition, then drinking a Luck potion, please let us know what your results are.- 17:27, 21 November 2011 (UTC)Luck increases the effectiveness of all the skill (except Acrobatics and Athletics) by 1 skill point for every 4 points of luck above 50. This also works the other way around; having a luck under 50 reduces your effectiveness. So the Lucky Old Lady spell raises your effectiveness to what it would be 5 skill points later. However, the increased effectiveness is capped to that of 100 skill points, so the skill increases beyond 100 skill points do nothing.

The Mercantile Effectiveness Formula should use the Luck-affected skill instead of the one shown at the stats page. Any skill points beyond 100 make a difference, but that is reverted when luck makes its difference. However, if something has caused luck to be below 50, the skill points above 100 help offset it.

The reason for jump height and running speed increasing when acrobatics and athletics go past 100 is that luck does not affect them in the first place. Oh, and the speechcraft skill doesn't have any actual effect on the prices you get. 20:10, 9 January 2012 (UTC) Findings based on disassembly of the game engine Nothing terribly much, but code analysis suggests that the game won't let you sell equipped items (makes sense) or poisoned items. Not sure about the latter; it's possible I misread a certain bitmask and it's actually checking ExtraCannotWear instead of ExtraPoison. Need to double-check.

Anyway, the phrase 'won't let you sell' here specifically means 'the items in question should not appear in the relevant menus.' 06:33, 17 January 2018 (UTC).